Kroon Harness for 944 Turbo

Talk and Tech about turbocharged 924/944/968 cars
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Tom
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NCGermerican wrote: Wed May 27, 2026 10:26 am
Tom wrote: Wed May 27, 2026 9:51 am
NCGermerican wrote: Wed May 27, 2026 7:42 am

Well great. Now you have me scared.....

They broke out a huge magnet and it almost flew out of his hand onto the flange, so I'm thinking it's mild steel. It's already all welded up. They definitely weren't laying dimes, but it also only cost me their shop minimum ($75).

They also recommended using some copper high temp exhaust gasket RTV. They said in a perfect world the crushable donut gasket should be enough, but I'm not dealing with a perfect world.

IMG_8048.jpegIMG_8049.jpeg
It's my understanding, based on various people who have tested these parts and reported the results online, that the flanges can be either mild steel or stainless, while the pipe itself is Incoloy 800 (or an unbranded alloy of similar content). Sounds like your flanges are mild steel — mine are too.

Try putting a magnet on the pipe itself. Assuming the magnet does not stick to the pipe, it is likely Incoloy 800.

I don’t mean to scare you, just trying to save you some extra work down the road. From the photos, those don’t look like TIG welds to me. They look more like MIG or stick welds, which makes me wonder/doubt whether the correct filler and process were used.

I’d still call and ask exactly how they welded it and what filler rod/wire they used, but I wouldn’t be overly optimistic unless they can give a confident answer. On the other hand, it’s impossible to say from here how long they might last — a month, a year, a decade? It’s not the space shuttle, so you could always install it as-is and cross your fingers. I’d just go in knowing there’s a real risk they will crack.
Well, at this point there's probably no going back regardless. I guess it was a good idea for me to hang onto the original crossover pipe in case I need it. Note to my future self though - if I (or anyone else) is in the same situation in the future, probably better to look for a machine shop to see if they are more knowledgeable in welding those types of metals together.

At least that part is after the primary o2, so I'm thinking if it does crack in the future it will only mess with my WBo2 readings.
Since you’re in the heart of NASCAR country, or at least a lot closer to it than most of us I assume, you probably have a much better chance of finding an Inconel/Incoloy-capable shop than most. Most exhaust shops would consider this “exotic metal” work — the kind of thing more commonly associated with aerospace, F1, NASCAR, a few high-performance cars, and, for some reason, the 944 Turbo. :angel: So it’s specialty work you may have to hunt down.

If you have a good spare crossover and don’t mind swapping it in later if necessary, there’s no real harm in trying this one as-is. For that matter, having it welded by a nickel-alloy-capable shop might cost more than it’s worth, for all I know. I just checked, and a 10 lb tube of Alloy 82 filler is over $900 at Grainger, compared with maybe $15/lb for ordinary filler rod. Then add the skill level and rarity of welders who know how to do this correctly, and the cost of re-welding that one might make the spare look pretty good.

Keep in mind, though, that if it does leak — even if it doesn’t throw off your O2 reading — it will reduce exhaust energy reaching the turbine. That means more turbo lag, less efficient boost, lower boost potential, etc. Any exhaust leak before the turbo can reduce performance. So if you get everything sorted and then one day the car starts feeling sluggish on boost, just something to keep in mind.

On the bright side, it sounds like you’re making real progress now. These are exactly the kinds of problems that seem like they “must” be one-in-a-million rare issues, but often turn out to be the same boring old problems most of these cars have — just hard to find. Finding them is 90% of the battle. So despite my relentless reality checks, I think you’re on a well-earth path to success now. Whether these issues were responsible for all your symptoms or just a few of several contributors, they are high-value finds. :)

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chrischrischris
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Fixed Yet? What's the status?

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chrischrischris wrote: Tue Jun 23, 2026 5:56 am Fixed Yet? What's the status?
I'm almost there! I've had more work travel, visitors and I sold my RS5 and bought a Cayenne GTS over the past few weeks. I've got everything sealed up and ready to start it up and see what happens. That will come this weekend after my Chicago work trip.

Stay tuned!
1987 951 - Nautic Blue over Linen
2013 Cayenne GTS Black (Daily)
2023 Durango R/T AWD - Destroyer Grey (Wife's Daily)
2013 Audi A5 Quattro - Brilliant Black (Son's daily)
1987 944 S - Nautic Blue over Linen - sold August 2024

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Best of luck!
Rob
89 944 Turbo
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#134

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So here’s another update. I thought I got all the exhaust and vacuum leaks taken care of. Started the car and only slight improvement. Still 15-16 in HG at idle and still lean at warm start- but my wBo2 seems to be more accurate.

Then it dawned on me. Whats the one system that is connected to the intake but wouldn’t show any leaks via smoke or boost leak test?….because it’s separated by a one way check valve? The HVAC system.

I hooked up my mighty vac on the vacuum line that supplies vacuum to the HVAC system on the passenger side of the check valve - it won’t hold vacuum at all. In fact it immediately goes down to zero.

I’m assuming this isn’t expected behavior, but wanted to confirm. My next step is to smoke test the HVAC system.
1987 951 - Nautic Blue over Linen
2013 Cayenne GTS Black (Daily)
2023 Durango R/T AWD - Destroyer Grey (Wife's Daily)
2013 Audi A5 Quattro - Brilliant Black (Son's daily)
1987 944 S - Nautic Blue over Linen - sold August 2024

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NCGermerican wrote: Sun Jun 28, 2026 12:31 pm So here’s another update. I thought I got all the exhaust and vacuum leaks taken care of. Started the car and only slight improvement. Still 15-16 in HG at idle and still lean at warm start- but my wBo2 seems to be more accurate.

Then it dawned on me. Whats the one system that is connected to the intake but wouldn’t show any leaks via smoke or boost leak test?….because it’s separated by a one way check valve? The HVAC system.

I hooked up my mighty vac on the vacuum line that supplies vacuum to the HVAC system on the passenger side of the check valve - it won’t hold vacuum at all. In fact it immediately goes down to zero.

I’m assuming this isn’t expected behavior, but wanted to confirm. My next step is to smoke test the HVAC system.
Can you post a pic of the line you tested?

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Tom wrote: Sun Jun 28, 2026 12:51 pm
Can you post a pic of the line you tested?
Here you go:
IMG_8157.jpeg
IMG_8157.jpeg (1.78 MiB) Viewed 40 times
1987 951 - Nautic Blue over Linen
2013 Cayenne GTS Black (Daily)
2023 Durango R/T AWD - Destroyer Grey (Wife's Daily)
2013 Audi A5 Quattro - Brilliant Black (Son's daily)
1987 944 S - Nautic Blue over Linen - sold August 2024

#137

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NCGermerican wrote: Sun Jun 28, 2026 1:05 pm
Tom wrote: Sun Jun 28, 2026 12:51 pm
Can you post a pic of the line you tested?
Here you go:
IMG_8157.jpeg
As a quick test, you can just plug those lines to see if vacuum improves at idle. I doubt it is big enough to drop the vacuum to 15 by itself, but every little leak adds up and is worth fixing. :angel: If your heater generally turns on an off as designed, your leak is likely in the vacuum canister over by the battery (rather than the hvac plumbing that t's off that line). Very common for the nipple to snap off or the canister to develop cracks/leaks. I'm starting to wonder if your issues may have been a thousand little cuts rather than one big 'aha' thing?

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Tom wrote: Sun Jun 28, 2026 2:40 pm As a quick test, you can just plug those lines to see if vacuum improves at idle. I doubt it is big enough to drop the vacuum to 15 by itself, but every little leak adds up and is worth fixing. :angel: If your heater generally turns on an off as designed, your leak is likely in the vacuum canister over by the battery (rather than the hvac plumbing that t's off that line). Very common for the nipple to snap off or the canister to develop cracks/leaks. I'm starting to wonder if your issues may have been a thousand little cuts rather than one big 'aha' thing?
I performed the test and no change at all. Another dead end. I'm also showing signs of incomplete combustion -despite showing 14.7 in closed loop, the exhaust smells VERY rich and I'm getting "pops", like unburnt fuel in the exhaust (full fabspeed w/ "high flow" cat).

I took a log on the ODB+ and uploaded into CGPT. I began with warm start, idle for 30 seconds, then 2,500 RPM for 30 seconds. Given all that has been replaced on this car, CGPT is now leaning more towards an electrical issue as opposed to a mechanical one. I'm also going to send the log to Joe at F9 to see what he says.
1987 951 - Nautic Blue over Linen
2013 Cayenne GTS Black (Daily)
2023 Durango R/T AWD - Destroyer Grey (Wife's Daily)
2013 Audi A5 Quattro - Brilliant Black (Son's daily)
1987 944 S - Nautic Blue over Linen - sold August 2024

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